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Feedback Wanted-New AAM Country Starter Kits
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12-7-gamer

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Post subject: Feedback Wanted-New AAM Country Starter Kits  Reply with quote   (Liked by:0)  Like this post
We are working with Barry Jenkins in the development of starter kits to help attract new players to the hobby. Wizards of The Coast has starter kits, but we feel that starter kits specific to particular countries would be more attractive and allow a player to build a 50-100 point army.

To help us with this project, we ask for your feedback. We need suggestions for changes in the units, additional units, fewer units, etc. for improved play balance. No suggestions will be refused!

You may obtain the proposed Starter Kits for the major countries in Axis & Allies Miniatures by using the following link to our blog which contains the Microsoft Excel spreadsheet.

http://12-7-games.blogspot.com/20...untry-starter-kits-feed-back.html

Simply click on the link and you will be able to download the file to your computer.  You must have Microsoft Excel installed on your computer in order to use the file.

Please be sure to post your feed back here in the foruMINI.

Thank you for your comments in this matter.

Bill
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PostTue Dec 21, 2010 4:40 pm
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joebunda

 
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One recommendation.  Save it as Excel 2003 file (.xls) to make it more accessible.  The .xlsx will open ONLY in Excel 2007/2010, while the .xls format works on a lot of 3rd party software also.
PostTue Dec 21, 2010 5:57 pm
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Thanks. I'll see what I can do about that.
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PostTue Dec 21, 2010 6:21 pm
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Buster

 
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Maybe I'm dumb, but which file in the downloaded folder is it that I should open? I try to open some files, but they are just weird looking.  Confused I have got Microsoft Excel 2007.
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mmarfox

 

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Very cool.  Great idea guys.  Just to ask, would these starter kits be sold along with counters, dice, and possibly maps, or are they just suggestions for us if we care to try to attract new players....or both?
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PostTue Dec 21, 2010 6:47 pm
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joebunda

 
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Buster wrote:
Maybe I'm dumb, but which file in the downloaded folder is it that I should open? I try to open some files, but they are just weird looking.  Confused I have got Microsoft Excel 2007.


I had the same problem.  It saves the file as .zip.  All you have to do is rename the file with a .xlsx file extension and it works fine.
PostTue Dec 21, 2010 7:13 pm
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Pablon

 

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I think it is a great idea to have this kind of packs and I think it could also work if you gave the option to add counters and dice either for the specific nation or not (if you are going to start playing you are gonna need them!).

In my opinion I would reduce the number of infantry units (try moving 6 Mosin with only one Comissar!) and maybe add one elite infantry.

For the germans I would trade the Nebelwerfer for a PAK or a Lel, and for the soviets trade the 76mm for a ZIS AT gun or a 81mm mortar (more common so easier for you to get) and the T-34/76 for a T-34/85 or a T-34/76 model 1942 (just to give them a rare).

But that's just me, I think you'll sell quite a few them anyway.
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DukeMikeIII

 

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I would not have aircraft for the starters. Make aircraft a bigger reason to want to buy the boosters. Also have infantry randomized on what is in the starters, not just a bunch of basic infantry, maybe have mortars in the starters. And a random piece of armor in the starter, not a random tiger or something like that but a average armor piece, say 5 defense no more than 13 die (Sherman, T34, PzIV equivalent). Add a transport, preferably a half track.

So in general make it somewhat random and no aircraft. My personal theory

6 random infanry
1 artillery
1 armored car
1 random well rounded piece of armor
1 transport
PostTue Dec 21, 2010 7:53 pm
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joebunda

 
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I have a bunch of suggestions.  I have included a link to my revision to the spreadsheet at the bottom.

- Remove Aircraft.  The air rules will just add confusion to the newbie, and add a lot of cost to the sets.
- Consider removing artillery...I am still mulling this one.
- Mix up the infantry a bit...for instance, replace 2 Mosin-Nagant with 2 PPSh.  This may also help reduce cost.
- Have 2 light vehicles.  For some countries you may need 2 tanks as well.
- Add Armored Car.
- Add a 5/5 or Steely Resolve infantry for each set.
- Add "Special" unit...this can be a surprise or bonus unit that is at least partially unique to that country.
- Japan is a special case...probably go with 1 tank, 1 A/C and plus up the infantry.

I tried to "normalize" each set to about 107 points using the framework of:
Infantry - 20pts
Commander - 8pts
Machine Gun - 8pts
Artillery - 10pts
Light Vehicle - 10pts
Tank - 25pts
Armored Car - 10pts
5/5 infantry - 8pts
"Special" - 8pts

- Counters are a must, but I would try to keep them inexpensive.  
- I think most gamers have enough dice or have other players that do.
- You may need to talk to WoTC about printing out some v1 maps (they print well on 11x17) and including 2 random ones with each set.

http://home.comcast.net/~joebunda...n/AAMStarterKits%20JB%20edit.xlsx
PostTue Dec 21, 2010 8:11 pm
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Thanks for the feedback. Please keep it coming. If you can, please recommend specific units for the starter kits.

thanks.

Bill
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PostTue Dec 21, 2010 8:12 pm
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mmarfox wrote:
Very cool.  Great idea guys.  Just to ask, would these starter kits be sold along with counters, dice, and possibly maps, or are they just suggestions for us if we care to try to attract new players....or both?


Both
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stevebravo

 

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Post subject: Re: Feedback Wanted-New AAM Country Starter Kits Reply with quote   (Liked by:0)  Like this post
hi 127 games Very Happy

Idea 1: It would be even great to make a starterset with 10 "new" units you cant get in sets we all know nowadays. Put a great (normandy) beach map in it.
I think that even the present fans would buy this set!

Idea 2: Make a starterset where you can combine W@S & AAM

Idea 3: make the starterset just like the starterset from 1939-1945, however, put plastic tokens in it, and new maps!

Idea 4: Make it a very large starter set, the price should not be the issue, think about 50 or 60 dollar or something with a dvd in it from all aam cards! Nice playable maps.. no papermaps, but real cardboard! Put units in it for 50 points axis, and 50 points allies, so you realy can play the game. Previous starterset, you are too dependent for single boosters.
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Bean965

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I second (and third) the idea suggested twice, above, that there be a little randomization in the kits - you'll have newbies buying more than one kit to both build their basic army and see what spiffy units they get at random.
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i'd suggest
1 med tank
1 light tank/armoured car
1 officer
4 infantry (at least 2 types Within)
1 support weapon mortar/mg/atg

I wouldnt have 5/5 infantry becausw they'll dominate
Trucks etc are a needless complication

Do include 1 new unopened booster with each kit
PostTue Dec 21, 2010 9:49 pm
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I think its a great idea and anything that attracts new players is good by me. I think I good starter set should be both basic and complete, with everything to play a balanced match and keep things affordable for younger players.
Keep things basic to start by using three elements: Infantry, Recon and Armor with no planes.

As far as how the sets should look, my first thought was create Infantry elements along the lines of the old platoon cards. For the recon element choose an armored car or lightly armored tank. Something like the humberAC. For the Armor element choose a Light tank and a Medium tank. Like the stuart and the Cromwell.

The end result for Britan would be around 100pts and look something like this:
(1) Inspiring Lt
(3) SMLE
(1) Bren Gun
(1) SMG
(1) BEF Inf
(1) 3 inch Mortar
(1) Vickers MG
(1) 6 pounder
(1) Humber AC
(1) Stuart
(1) Cromwell

Just a few thoughts worth 2 cents.  Smile
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PostTue Dec 21, 2010 11:17 pm
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Flakstruk wrote:
i'd suggest
1 med tank
1 light tank/armoured car
1 officer
4 infantry (at least 2 types Within)
1 support weapon mortar/mg/atg

I wouldnt have 5/5 infantry becausw they'll dominate
Trucks etc are a needless complication

Do include 1 new unopened booster with each kit


I like this approach. Give the new player enough pieces that they can explore the game a bit but not so much so that they get muddled in some of the more complicated rules. Avoid aircraft. Avoid transport. Avoid spotting/indirect fire.

Stick with a cheap medium tank to keep the cost down. As others have said, the Sherman, Panzer IV, Cromwell, T-34 and others along that line are great for this. An officer is a must as is a light armored vehicle.

For the soldier type units I think there needs to be a bit of flexibility. Adding 2 or 3 basic infantry to the mix makes sense but I think you also need at least one support weapon and some artillery. Something with some AT ability would be good so the US could get the bazooka and the Germans could have the Panzerfaust etc. A MG would be nice and so would a direct fire artillery piece of some sort. I'd balance the support/MG/artillery pieces where possible to give the group of pieces as a whole some capability against both armor and soldiers. And keep the pieces fairly cheap to keep the cost down. The cheaper you can make the pieces then the more money you can devote to things like counters/maps/dice and still keep the cost within reason.

You might also consider including a little scenario with each group that would pair those pieces up against a starter set of another country. Give the buyer some incentive to pick up another set but at the same time allow the buyer to play the pieces either by points or with a scenario. That might be a little added bonus that would be a nice addition that at the same time would be something they wouldn't get with the WotC stater.

How are you going to handle rules? If this is for a new player then are you introducing these sets as an alternative to the official starters or to be used in conjunction with those starters?
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PostTue Dec 21, 2010 11:48 pm
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Flakstruk is going the right direction for me.  Keep the set to 50 points or so for each opponent.  One medium tank, one light tank or truck/halftrack/armored car.  An officer with a few infantry and a support unit.

Here are my suggestions.  For the most part they are 50 pts, with a few 51 point builds.  

Germany
PzIV F2
MG 42
Sd Kfz 251
Moto Schutzen
Pzfaust
Mauser Kar

Romania
T-4
Vigilant Lt.
Antitank Grenadier x2
RO Infantry x3

Hungary
Pz 38(t) x2
37mm AT gun x2
Tenacious Officer
8mm Huzagol x5

Finland
StuG III G
MG team x2
Officer
Ski Troop
Infantry x3

Italy
Vet Carro
Carro Armato
Stalwart Lt.
Fucile Modello x3
Blackshirt
Brenda Modello
Conscript


Soviets
T-34/76
Vet NCO
Commissar
Mosin-Nagant x4

U.S.
M4A1 Sherman
RD Cpt.
Bazooka
Thompson Gunner
M1 Garand x2
CCKW 352
Untested Recruit

Britain
Cromwell IV
Vickers MG team
Humber Scout car
PIAT Gunner
SMLE Rifle x2


Yes, I do realize there are some better choices, but I have yet to get my first set of CO and I don't have complete sets of any of the others.  I just have what I have.  No Version 1 sets for the most part.  I know that really hurts my builds but having both versions on the board just make it look so amateurish and I don't want to get FoW if I can help it.  My Hungarians look the worst here, but when I put a Tiger on the table with them they don't look so easy.  Laughing

edit:  Just thought of the maps and the rules, the rules come with a map or two.  Maybe divide out the Started set into useful sets of 50 points and add in some fillers to make two sides.  I remember how disappointed I was to buy a Starter set and not be able to actually play a game because I had all these extra pieces I couldn't use and not enough pieces so I could actually play a game.  Very disappointed for several weeks until I bought several boosters, because the first booster didn't really do anything to help my plight.
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PostTue Dec 21, 2010 11:53 pm
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Thanks to everyone for their posts. Please keep the ideas coming. You are giving me some very good ideas that I'm sure we can use.

Just to let you know, I am looking into some markers to go with the kits, but I'm trying to keep the cost down.

Everything will be coinsidered, so thanks again.
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i'd probably do 60 point builds.
way more tactical options
No Aircraft

Romania
T4 23
251 8
Cavalry 4
Vigil lui 8
Ro Inf x3 9
AT Gren

60 points

The Hook is give them a taste of everything to get the hunger.
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RAEVSKI wrote:
i'd probably do 60 point builds.
way more tactical options
No Aircraft

Romania
T4 23
251 8
Cavalry 4
Vigil lui 8
Ro Inf x3 9
AT Gren

60 points

The Hook is give them a taste of everything to get the hunger.


Good point. That is exactly what we want to do. There is no sense in making a starter kit if they don't want to get more & play the game.

thanks.

Bill


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