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Surcouf and "destroying the enemy surface fleet"
 
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LcdrSwizzle

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Post subject: Surcouf and "destroying the enemy surface fleet"  Reply with quote   (Liked by:0)  Like this post
Yep, same battle yesterday, and we had "Surcouf" on one side. We ran into a question we did not expect.

Surcouf can be either a "destroyer" (surface ship!) or a "submarine", so declared at the start of the Sea Movement phase, and it so stays until the end of the turn.

This brought out 2 questions for us.

So, if Surcouf is a "destroyer", (surface ship) does that mean if it is the ONLY surface ship on your side that the enemy does NOT get the points for eliminating your surface fleet?

Also, can a "destroyer" Surcouf fire torpedoes?

Submarine Corsair: At the beginning of your Sea Movement step, declare whether this unit's type will be Destroyer or Submarine until the end of this turn. It can make Antiair and Gunnery attacks only while it's a Destroyer. It can use Submerged Shot only while it's a Sub.
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RAEVSKI

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It can fire torps or main gun. Torps while submerged, guns while a DD type.
I personally would allow it to use both while surfaced.
It counts as a submarine and only counts as a destroyer for shooting and targeting purposes.
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As to the surface bonus part -

Surcouf has No Sea Control so does not count for Surface Elimination anyway.

If you wipe out all your opponents ships except for MTB's and most Auxillaries, you still get the Surface Elimination bonus because those units cannot capture objectives.  (They can oppose them however).  

From the opposition standpoint then, having Surcouf surface to contest an objective (a sub cannot contest, but a DD can) is a valid strategy, but of course then Surcouf is also vulnerable to surface fire.
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I agree with both answers. You can attack with your guns and torpedoes while on the surface. But note that you cannot attack another sub while you are surfaced. You can only attack another sub by using "Submerged Shot" when you are a sub.
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LcdrSwizzle

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Can it fire torpedoes as a destroyer? Some answers above don't address that part.
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PostMon Feb 08, 2016 3:03 am
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LcdrSwizzle wrote:
Can it fire torpedoes as a destroyer? Some answers above don't address that part.


I just looked at the card again and I agree it is silent on the use of torpedoes when surfaced. Since it doesn't say it can't, then the rule is that it can. However, it cannot target a sub when it is a destroyer. It specifically says it can only use Submerged Shot when it is a sub. And that was very intentional.
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PostMon Feb 08, 2016 6:19 am
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LcdrSwizzle

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Post subject: Reply with quote   (Liked by:0)  Like this post
weedsrock2 wrote:
LcdrSwizzle wrote:
Can it fire torpedoes as a destroyer? Some answers above don't address that part.


I just looked at the card again and I agree it is silent on the use of torpedoes when surfaced. Since it doesn't say it can't, then the rule is that it can. However, it cannot target a sub when it is a destroyer. It specifically says it can only use Submerged Shot when it is a sub. And that was very intentional.


Okay, we had a member reading the SA as if it said:

As a destroyer, only AA and gunnery.
As a sub, only torpedoes.

Thanks for straightening that out for us!
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PostTue Feb 09, 2016 7:28 pm
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Subs could and did fire torpedoes at surface targets while they themselves were surfaced, so... why not. Very Happy


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