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Post subject: The ideal Royal Navy 100 points?
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I've been giving some thought to an ideal Royal Navy 100-point hand.
I've come up with this:
HMS Warspite - 46 pts
HMS Fencer - 14 pts
Hr Ms Van Galen - 8 pts
HMS Truculent - 12 pts
Swordfish - 10 pts
=90pts
The extra 10pts are then spent either offensively or defensively
Offensive - another Swordfish
Defensive - two Sea Hurricanes @ 5pts and both based ashore, one flying on each alternate move.
Tactics: the three warships stay together and always move in the same square. They will be slower because of Fencer's move of 'one' so I'd aim for the middle objective if you are playing with objectives. Plough into that slow and steady and then either go for an untouched left or right objective or else seek and destroy to get the points.
Van Galen's SA means all three ships can remain in the same square. Fencer's Fighter Cover ranges out to three squares so it is vital that Truculent remains within the three squares umbrella while the enemy still has airborne ASW. Once airborne ASW is written down Truculent can free hunt or orbit the main group as an ASW asset herself.
If you play offensive keep the two Swordfish well in hand. I'd favour staying within three squares of Warspite/Fencer/Van Galen and only flying both when the land-based second is available - on alternate moves. If attacked by a U-boat use the Fencer's Swordfish in ASW role, again within the three square Fighter Cover umbrella.
Enemy submarines can be attacked by Truculent, Van Galen or the Swordfish while Warspite's triple battery is enough to keep two enemy cruisers occupied at the same time and probably vital one of them.
Now if the other player gets familiar with this hand then the third variation is to use the spare 10 points for a 9pt Beaufighter every once in a while and play at 99pts.
Another variation would be to sacrifice Truculent for more air or maybe some more destroyers. One could almost squeeze a cruiser @13pts (say cruiser and Beaufighter) but keep the cruiser in the three square Fighter Cover umbrella early in the game - perhaps to run ahead and grab an objective.
Thoughts anyone?
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 Thu Dec 25, 2008 10:01 pm |
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teamwork
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i like it its a good fleet to beat fleets not including big carriers
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| Fri Dec 26, 2008 12:26 am |
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It looks like a very sound fleet to me. The main weakness I see is the Fencer sitting alone in a sector. As an opponent I would go for that first to remove the AA cover and the ability to fly one aircraft every turn. Even so, that means using my offensive aircraft (if I have any) on an escort carrier for one or two turns instead of attacking the main battle fleet.
I think the Truculent is a 'must' as part of the mix. It has the ability to 'worry' your opponent and push him around the map a bit, and is also a vital component if your opponent brings a fleet centered on a big battleship.
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| Fri Dec 26, 2008 6:03 am |
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I think that Rodney is more solid compared to Warspite+Swordfish. The latter depends too much on luck I think. What year limit do you have in mind and what enemy nation?
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| Fri Dec 26, 2008 1:21 pm |
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| weedsrock2 wrote: | It looks like a very sound fleet to me. The main weakness I see is the Fencer sitting alone in a sector. As an opponent I would go for that first to remove the AA cover and the ability to fly one aircraft every turn. Even so, that means using my offensive aircraft (if I have any) on an escort carrier for one or two turns instead of attacking the main battle fleet.
I think the Truculent is a 'must' as part of the mix. It has the ability to 'worry' your opponent and push him around the map a bit, and is also a vital component if your opponent brings a fleet centered on a big battleship. |
Read the tactics. The three basic warships remain in the same square at all times and give each other mutual support for AA, etc. There is no way I'd allow HMS Fencer to wander off on its own.
Amen on HMS Truculent. I would not like to sacrifice her but that sacrifice is offered as an option.
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Last edited by 'Warspite' on Fri Dec 26, 2008 1:57 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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| Fri Dec 26, 2008 1:46 pm |
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| NeuralDream wrote: | | I think that Rodney is more solid compared to Warspite+Swordfish. The latter depends too much on luck I think. What year limit do you have in mind and what enemy nation? |
Not against the Japanese (or US) so I see this as an ideal European/Atlantic/Mediterranean hand for use against German/Italian/Vichy French forces.
Playing against the Japanese would need more thought.
HMS Rodney would be nice but we are dealing with a strict 100pt budget and the need to be 'all things to all men' - or in this case deal with every contingency.
Warspite has enough firepower to deal with anything short of Yamato while her extra range means she can actually shoot outside HMS Fencer's fighter cover umbrella.
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| Fri Dec 26, 2008 1:48 pm |
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| 'Warspite' wrote: | | weedsrock2 wrote: | It looks like a very sound fleet to me. The main weakness I see is the Fencer sitting alone in a sector. As an opponent I would go for that first to remove the AA cover and the ability to fly one aircraft every turn. Even so, that means using my offensive aircraft (if I have any) on an escort carrier for one or two turns instead of attacking the main battle fleet.
I think the Truculent is a 'must' as part of the mix. It has the ability to 'worry' your opponent and push him around the map a bit, and is also a vital component if your opponent brings a fleet centered on a big battleship. |
Read the tactics. The three basic warships remain in the same square at all times and give each other mutual support for AA, etc. There is no way I'd allow HMS Fencer to wander off on its own.
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My bad. I somehow got it into my head there were three ships other than Fencer and the Fencer was 'shadowing' within three squares.
Hmmm. 
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| Fri Dec 26, 2008 5:08 pm |
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Why is the rum always gone?
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I must agree that this is a great Atlantic/Med fleet. To go into the Pacific, though, I'd swap the Warspite for a KGV and bring a Sea'Cane with the remaining five points. (Well, I would if I had a KGV... actually, I don't even have a Warspite... hmm... maybe I should fix these problems...)
Cheers...
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| Mon Dec 29, 2008 1:49 am |
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There's additional incentive to run Rodney in this fleet because its big drawback, its slowness, wouldn't hurt you. After all, you have to move one square at a time thanks to Fencer anyway.
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| Sun Jan 11, 2009 2:01 pm |
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| jfkziegler wrote: | | There's additional incentive to run Rodney in this fleet because its big drawback, its slowness, wouldn't hurt you. After all, you have to move one square at a time thanks to Fencer anyway. |
The problem with including HMS Rodney is its 58 point price tag, that's 12 points above HMS Warspite. Those points effectively cost you HMS Truculent and you only gain one extra armour point and one extra gunnery dice. You also lose Warspite's third gun battery.
In drawing up this 100pt force the Rodney was very carefully considered and then rejected. So was KGV. The aim is to try and create an ideal force which can meet most contingencies and most enemies and make the most of overlapping SAs. That means the biggest battleship, the best cruiser, lots of aeroplanes or lots of submarines all have to be compromised to meet 100 points.
Now if I was playing 150 or 200 points then HMS Rodney would be seriously reconsidered... but for 100 pts suddenly the Warspite becomes an attractive option because of the other weapons it then allows.
I would like to hear from anyone who has attempted to use the 'task force Warspite' in action. How did you get on with it and who were you playing against?
smile!
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| Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:39 pm |
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A few weeks ago, I took what I remember of this build against a Italian fleet run by Aquarius. I lost to a "OMG where'd you get all those SM79s! + battleship build, but it was close.
Trading the Swordfish for two more hurricanes would have helped. Or if the Truculent had scored any hits. Or if my range six shot had hit. It's a good build, I was unlucky I think.
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| Wed Jan 14, 2009 8:51 pm |
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| Hawker Hurricane wrote: | A few weeks ago, I took what I remember of this build against a Italian fleet run by Aquarius. I lost to a "OMG where'd you get all those SM79s! + battleship build, but it was close.
Trading the Swordfish for two more hurricanes would have helped. Or if the Truculent had scored any hits. Or if my range six shot had hit. It's a good build, I was unlucky I think. |
Interesting feed-back.
Where did he get all those SM-79s from?
Any other experiences?
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| Wed Jan 14, 2009 9:37 pm |
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He had 4 SM-79's, one fighter, a Cesare, and a pair of destroyers. The torpedo planes killed me.
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| Wed Jan 14, 2009 11:50 pm |
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| 'Warspite' wrote: | | jfkziegler wrote: | | There's additional incentive to run Rodney in this fleet because its big drawback, its slowness, wouldn't hurt you. After all, you have to move one square at a time thanks to Fencer anyway. |
The problem with including HMS Rodney is its 58 point price tag, that's 12 points above HMS Warspite. Those points effectively cost you HMS Truculent and you only gain one extra armour point and one extra gunnery dice. You also lose Warspite's third gun battery.
In drawing up this 100pt force the Rodney was very carefully considered and then rejected. So was KGV. The aim is to try and create an ideal force which can meet most contingencies and most enemies and make the most of overlapping SAs. That means the biggest battleship, the best cruiser, lots of aeroplanes or lots of submarines all have to be compromised to meet 100 points.
Now if I was playing 150 or 200 points then HMS Rodney would be seriously reconsidered... but for 100 pts suddenly the Warspite becomes an attractive option because of the other weapons it then allows.
I would like to hear from anyone who has attempted to use the 'task force Warspite' in action. How did you get on with it and who were you playing against?
smile! |
Sounds like fun. I'll give it a shot sometime and let you know how it comes out. Warspite is a favorite of mine, and I don't need much encouragement to play her. My only concern is the slow speed of Fencer. I'm a little worried my opponent will have the objectives grabbed while I'm still closing in. I do like the idea of Fencer's range 3 covering the Truculent in case the other fellow brings an ASW aircraft. |
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| Thu Jan 15, 2009 2:04 am |
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| Hawker Hurricane wrote: | | He had 4 SM-79's, one fighter, a Cesare, and a pair of destroyers. The torpedo planes killed me. |
I don't remember that one.
I do remember the one with the SM79s against your Japanese fleet. Now that was fun.
I've been playing Italians for the last month, they all kind of blend together.
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| Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:53 am |
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| Hawker Hurricane wrote: | | He had 4 SM-79's, one fighter, a Cesare, and a pair of destroyers. The torpedo planes killed me. |
Ahhh! I can see how that might have been a problem. However if you keep everything under Fencer's CAP umbrella and keep Warspite, Fencer and the DD in the same square he should face the Fencer's CAP SA plus three lines of AA from the ships. That should have blunted the onslaught.
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| Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:47 pm |
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| Rangefinder wrote: |
Sounds like fun. I'll give it a shot sometime and let you know how it comes out. Warspite is a favorite of mine, and I don't need much encouragement to play her. My only concern is the slow speed of Fencer. I'm a little worried my opponent will have the objectives grabbed while I'm still closing in. I do like the idea of Fencer's range 3 covering the Truculent in case the other fellow brings an ASW aircraft. |
Look at the option (above) for adding a cruiser to the mix which races ahead to grab one objective.
Also remember that even at your slow speed he should not be able to grab all three objectives. Aim for the middle one. If he goes for middle and left, you switch to the right one or visa-versa.
Of course if you fear he might be able to grab all three then that is the time to play the 'offensive' option with both Swordfish. Use a double Swordfish strike to keep him away from an objective, preferably on the same move he is staging an air strike on you. That way his fighters have to choose between escort on their strike or attacking the Swordfish.
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| Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:50 pm |
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| 'Warspite' wrote: | | Rangefinder wrote: |
Sounds like fun. I'll give it a shot sometime and let you know how it comes out. Warspite is a favorite of mine, and I don't need much encouragement to play her. My only concern is the slow speed of Fencer. I'm a little worried my opponent will have the objectives grabbed while I'm still closing in. I do like the idea of Fencer's range 3 covering the Truculent in case the other fellow brings an ASW aircraft. |
Look at the option (above) for adding a cruiser to the mix which races ahead to grab one objective.
Also remember that even at your slow speed he should not be able to grab all three objectives. Aim for the middle one. If he goes for middle and left, you switch to the right one or visa-versa.
Of course if you fear he might be able to grab all three then that is the time to play the 'offensive' option with both Swordfish. Use a double Swordfish strike to keep him away from an objective, preferably on the same move he is staging an air strike on you. That way his fighters have to choose between escort on their strike or attacking the Swordfish. |
Thanks for pointing out the cruiser option. Had missed that from your original message. I've also thought about using a Beaufighter rather than the Swordfish or two Hurrys for the last 10 points. I like the fighter-torpedo option the Beaufighter gives. Disadvantage, of course, is that he couldn't fly every turn. |
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| Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:17 pm |
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| Rangefinder wrote: |
Disadvantage, of course, is that he couldn't fly every turn. |
Indeed, such is the nature of compromise. 100 points is a hard budget to work to. My exercise was to try and get the best out of 100 pts.
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| Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:42 pm |
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I have to agree with Warpite on this. Anytime you build a UK fleet it is a compromise. They are outclassed by almost every nation at every position. Warspite is the best option they have at 100pts, too bad WotC designers felt that a USN cruiser had better torpedo protection.  If you want a great UK fleet you almost have to borrow from commonwealth countries or do some lend/lease for decent aircover. I like playing the brits, but as one of the major countries they have gotten the shaft. BB's with fatal flaw, jammed mount, and lack of TD. Two heavy cruisers with NO secondaries that are outclassed by all other CA's. Their two CL options are they best options they have. ONLY 1 DD IN TWO SETS!!! evidentally the brits had 4 times as many BB's as destroyers. Wait, I lied. The brits have a great sub. not the best but in my top three. Rodney is a great unit, but Slow 1 always bites me in the but at the worst time possible.
I like your build Warspite, although I have very limited luck with Swordfish. I consider them a success if they get one hit before being AA fodder.
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| Thu Jan 15, 2009 8:49 pm |
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