110pt German build to meet 110pt Russian build-1942

Field Marshal PF · 110pt German build to meet 110pt Russian build-1942

Ok, so I came up with these two builds:

#1

7x Mauser Kar 98k(21pts)
1x Wehrmacht Veteran Infantrymen(5pts)
1x Flammenwerfer 35(5pts)
2x SS-Panzergrenadiers(14pts)
1x SS-Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
1x Sd Kfz 251(6pts)
1x Veteran Panzer III Ausf. L(19pts)
1x Panzer IV Ausf. G(23pts)

Total: 100pts

#2

3x Mauser Kar 98k(9pts)
2x Wehrmacht Veteran Infantrymen(10pts)
1x Flammenwerfer 35(5pts)
1x SS-Panzergrenadiers(7pts)
1x SS-Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
1x Sd Kfz 251(6pts)
1x Tiger I(56pts)

Total: 100pts

Suggestions and changes?

TorontoBizz

I like the first build best. At our last tournament one the players brought an all German infantry build (200 points) with a few Opel Blitz. He was able to close assault all of the Russian tanks and won. If the Russian bring any vehicles with "blast" and "bombardment" you might be in trouble.

Steel_Panther

Number one looks good to me, but I would find some way to get more armor in it as an infantry protector.

PantherDude3000

#1 looks nice, would be perfect if it had a little more armor.

Andreas3

I too like the first one, but consider dropping out a Kar for a Opel Blitz becase otherwise it'll take forever for your units to get near the objective.

ps. not that I have that much experience but I thought I might as well tell my humble opinion.

Shank77

Out of the two builds, I would choose the first build.

Field Marshal PF

Any good options for countering 2 KV-1s? Besides the Tiger I.

Steel_Panther

JagdPanthers, SS Panthers, Vet Tigers, Infantry swarm, nukes Smile

Lt_V

A pair of Stukas, Spotter and an ammo dump....

Field Marshal PF

1942 solutions* Very Happy

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Lt_V

D'oh! Sorry about that!

Maybe a pair of Pak 40s and a pair of PzIV G/F2s...that is tough...

Field Marshal PF

Sorry to add guys but I got a call from my FLGS. Each side has 110pts for this round. Also, it is scenario based, I start out without cover(approach to stalingrad map) while the Russians get cover. I'm expecting KVs and mortars, maybe katyuahas, so maybe I should scrap and rebuild? Aircraft and howitzers are now a real possibility, maybe 88s?

Field Marshal PF

The map:

Field Marshal PF

My quick-thought-of mobile blitzkreig build:

2x Panzer IV Ausf. G(46pts)
1x Veteran Panzer III Ausf. L(19pts)
2x Sdkfz 251(12pts)
2x Panzergrenadiers(8pts)
1x SS Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
6x Mauser Kar 98k(18pts)

Total: 110pts

Field Marshal PF

Or maybe this?

1x Panzer IV Ausf. G(23pts)
1x Veteran Panzer III Ausf. L(19pts)
1x Me 110(17pts)
3x Sdkfz 251(18pts)
3x Panzergrenadiers(12pts)
1x SS Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
3x Mauser Kar 98k(9pts)
1x Wehrmacht Veteran Infantrymen(5pts)

Steel_Panther

Very tough map. 110 would be a good choice, as would MGs and a Panther mabie? Or go with an infantry swarm and try to swamp them. Stugs or something as bait, then a swarm of rifles or vets

Field Marshal PF

Panther is 1943, so its out. I want to take out those BM-13s and 82mm while my panzergrenadier force, so my main infantry force can move safely in the open terrain.

Lt_V

How 'bout 1 or 2 nebelwerfers...fight fire with fire Wink

Field Marshal PF

Yep, nebels are good, but they need spotters. If only aircraft could spot.

Lt_V

I was thinking about a Puma but it is a '43 AFV...what is the year on the new "puma"?

Just thinking it is fast and has a lot of firepower....maybe a BMW would do the trick...

Field Marshal PF

Hmm.... mortars and spotters are going to kill me, then again if he brings heavy armour...He probably won't bring both. So maybe I should keep it at 2 armoured units, and mobile infantry with air support. Russian stuff is rugged and cheap, German stuff is expensive and fragile. Got tpo assume he has the mortars.

Lt_V

maybe a Vet tiger with some PGs for support...it's probably the best thing for the time frame vs USSR....the PzIVs are too fragile....

Field Marshal PF

How about this one?

1x Panzer IV Ausf. G(23pts)
1x Veteran Panzer III Ausf. L(19pts)
2x Panzer III Ausf. F(26pts)
2x Sdkfz 251(12pts)
2x Panzergrenadiers(8pts)
1x SS Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
5x Mauser Kar 98k(15pts)

Total: 110pts

Smoke screens help my infantry advance into cover. Then the Pz III F. escort the infantry in the city and my PzIVG and Vet PzIIIL go tank hunting. I loose the precious Me 110 air support though.

Eric Marino

Here's what I'd do. The first thing that comes to my mind is to do what you can to make sure your opponent doesn't have any units on the outside line of the city. If your opponent can't see you he can't attack you. Your second priority should be to get into the city yourself.If you're in the city with him you negate his only advantage (him having cover and you not). As the attacker you "should" be able to see where he places his units before you place yours, if so choose the weakest area with the least concentration of units and enter there. Everything must be able to fight in the city, once you're in the city the rest of your units that scared your enemy behind the city should follow. Killing off his commanders is top priority, a combination of the vet NCO and the Cossack Captain can mean his grenadiers can waltz into your hex at def 5 and you have a penalty of -1 on each die. The Italian Commander with its bonus to defensive fire could go a long way to keep that dreaded hand to hand from happening. Tanks aren't a priority they can easily be dealt with with your powerful close assault. If your opponent has spotters and artillery the spotters are NOT important. Spotters can only help to target soldiers, and all of your units are in halftracks right? Ignore the arty unless it's within range, if it is within range attack it with what it can't hit well (soldier against ATgun, Halftrack/Amored Car vs MG). You should Attack from two sides in order to force your opponent to either split his forces or forfeit the objective(by the way what is the objective?).

The Wehrmacht Vet inf is going to be your best soldier because of the suppressive fire. Make sure you have one for each vehicle you have, they can stop your opponent from close assaulting you. The half track sounds like a really good idea to me, get in to the city as fast as you can and use these to get you there. They are better than other options because they can make attacks and the units in them are immune to incoming anti soldier fire. The 4pt Panzerfaust is going to be your best anti tank unit because the longest range in the city is still within your reach. Flamethrowers in halftracks are cheaper and better than flamingos in every way but one point of front def. They can even make Defensive Fire against soldiers. A SiG33 wouldn't be wasted points, keep it away from the heavy stuff and get it in the city, have it supported by some WehrVets and close assault shouldn't be a problem. Concentrate on being able to take out enemy soldiers while minimizing the return fire. Again halftracks do well to keep you safe, your opponent can usually only throw two dice at you from close range. If things get bad or your opponent went crazy with ptrds bail on the halftracks once your in the city. Even if your units aren't in the halftracks you should always attempt to attack with them, they're just as good as your other units against soldiers.

Avoid taking any SS panzer grenadiers, the snipers like them too much. I would also avoid taking too many tanks, this map is going to be won or lost by soldiers. If your opponent takes lots of tanks it will be an easy win. Below is what my ideal plan would be, this would change depending on the opponent but this is what I'd try to do.

Warning Super Top Secret Battle Plan Ahead!!!

Field Marshal PF

First of all I'd like to thank for putting so much time and effort into this. Its like i'm consulting with another staff officer before the big attack. I see what you mean about the flanks. Originally I was going to keeping infantry in the south flank , armour in the north flank and the Me 110 to take care of AT guns and mortars. I woulkd have though he would choose a fight with my tanks in the open, so I could rush my panzergrenadiers and 251s to the city, dump them there and the half tracks go back to pick up more infantry. Alright, i'll scratch build and see what I come up with. The panzerfaust is 1943 so its unavailable though.

Field Marshal PF

1x Panzer IV Ausf. G(23pts)
1x Veteran Panzer III Ausf. L(19pts)
1x Sd Kfz 251(6pts)
1x Panzergrenadiers(4pts)
3x Wehrmacht Veteran Infantrymen(15pts)
1x Wehrmacht Oberleutnant(13pts)
5x Mauser Kar 98k(15pts)
1x sIG 33(15pts)

If I go with the SS commander, I get better initaitive and 6 more points but like you said the snipers love the SS.

I'm still leaning to the Me 110 for a support piece rather than the sIG. With the sIG I have to be very warry of where his armour is going, he might try and send his armour out after it, losing cover just to get even a long range shot on it. With the Me 110 I can harass his infantry late game when there is concentrated fire, he won't waste attacks on a plane when I have infantry right in front of him. Ditch the sIG and one Vet inf and get the Me 110 and a Kar 98.

Field Marshal PF

A variation if I take the SS commander:

1x Panzer IV Ausf. G(23pts)
1x Veteran Panzer III Ausf. L(19pts)
1x Sd Kfz 251(6pts)
1x Panzergrenadiers(4pts)
5x Wehrmacht Veteran Infantrymen(25pts)
1x SS Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
3x Mauser Kar 98k(9pts)
1x Me 110(17pts)

My Me 110 can nail the sniper early on and I can use the initative and abilites of the SS Haupsturmfuhrer.

George Krashos

Where's the map from? Is it (was it) commercially available?

-- George Krashos

Field Marshal PF

It was commercially available, its out of print now.

http://hbfronts.com/

RedBaron

Shank77

I have played a couple games on this map. Armour was never a real problem in the game I played. Everbodys in the city before you know it and it comes down to line of sight and everboby got a chance for cover. Two German pieces I have seen that do the most damage are the Panzer II (F) "Flamingo" 1941 and SS Stormtroopers 1940. I would also think the new Flammenwerfer 35 1939 would be a good option too. By power of flame you don't have to worry about cover and clean up with the SS stormtrooper with 11 dice at range 1 in the city and he has ruthless. When I played on this map the German player had to take all the docks on the river to win. Just curious if that is the German objective in this game?

Field Marshal PF

Oh the objective is the entire city itself, after 10 turns, whoever has the most units in the city wins(in terms of point cost values). If it is close, within 5 points of each other, an additional turn is played.

Field Marshal PF

Oh the objective is the entire city itself, after 10 turns, whoever has the most units in the city wins(in terms of point cost values). If it is close, within 5 points of each other, an additional turn is played.

Steel_Panther

Then the fast PZGs looks good to me. You could have some Stug III Ds as Infantry support, and then the 251s as ferrys

TorontoBizz

The Wehrmacht Oberleutnant is only available in 1943. He is armed with a Panzerfaust so it makes sense that they would both have the same date.

Field Marshal PF

2 or 3 251s would be idea, but I can only manage 1, any more and my infantry force takes a hit. Stug IIIs aren't a bad idea, but they are fragile. Hmm....Red Baron suggested a Tiger, which I can see clearly why, but that would cost half my assault force. Its an investment that usually pays off. Hm, I don't think we are playing hyper-historical so maybe a Tiger might not be a bad decision;

1x Tiger I(56pts)
6x Wehrmacht Veteran Infantrymen(30pts)
1x SS Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
1x Me 110(17pts)

A bit cheesy, but hey, i'm expect the cheese express from the russkies.

Field Marshal PF

Field Marshal PF

The Germans may not have cheap infantry AT in 1942, but the Romanians and Hungarians do. The Bohler is great at 6pts, but whether it can penetrate KV armour, is a long shot. The Italian 75/18 is also available.

Lt_V

The Tiger I also gives you overrun, and if you are involved in close combat that alone could make a big difference...

Field Marshal PF

I've decided i'm going with this;

1x Tiger I(56pts)
1x SS Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
1x Me 110(17pts)

and either 10x Mauser Kar 98k or 6x Wehrmacht Vetera infantrymen.

Field Marshal PF

So the question now is, lots of standard infantry or less high quality infantry.

Shank77

Are you able to use the platoon cards? If so maybe the Hungarian Infantry Company.
1x Tenacious Officer
8X 8mm Huzagol 35m
1X 37mm Light Antitank Gun
All of it for 24 points. If I did my math right you can still add 2 Mauser to the build.

Field Marshal PF

Great Idea!

My last minute change:

1x Tiger(56pts)
1x Me 110(17pts)
1x Hungarian infantry company(24pts)
1x SS Haupsturmfuhrer(7pts)
2x Mauser Kar 98k(6pts)

Field Marshal PF

Alright, i'm leaving for the game, i'd like to thank every one who provided input, God knows I appreciate it. Wish me luck, and i'll file a report once I get home.

Winner

Shank77

Good luck!

Steel_Panther

Go get em, Panther! Laughing

Eric Marino

I should have known better about the Panzerfaust, I suppose that happens when you post that late.

Well to explain where I'm coming from this is what I'd use as the Russians on that map.

006, 06, x2 Communist Partisans
038, 32, x8 Soviet Grenadiers
050, 16, x4 DP 27
068, 18, x2 Cossack Captain
078, 10, x2 Commisar
090, 08, x2 PTRD 41
102, 12, x4 Mosin Nagant
110, 08, x8 Tank Trap

My stratagy as the Russians

Eric Marino

Well, it appears I was too late...

Shank77

Nice Russian stratagy, looks tough.

Field Marshal PF

Alright guys, i'm back,...and I won! Ok, before I get into the fighting, i'll give yout the enemy build;

2x NCO
4x Mosin-Nagant
1x Maxim
2x Sniper
2x AT gun
1x T-34/76
1x Mortar
1x Spotter

So heres how it went. First turn, he hid his T-34 in the city, avoiding my Tiger, I kept all my infantry behind the forests, so the MG and snipers wouldnt have a shot. My Me 110 targeted his mortar first, and killed it. He lost his main AI unit and frustratedly rush half my infantry with the T-34(I split my force up). The Me 110 went on to kill both AT guns and snipers, and my Tiger overran one of his NCOs, which was subsequently killed my Huzagols the same turn. His close assualts on my Tiger were fruitless, and I overran his other NCO, his NCO would amazingly live for two more turns, and my Huzagols were being choped by his maxim. My Me 110 killed a 1891/30 and helped disrupt thye NCO twice. His remaining infantry could only move in the assualt but he finally showed his hand and brought the T-34 out and on the border of the city, having cover. My Tiger disrupted twice(due to amazing cover rolls) but finally killed the T-34. My infantry were almost gone, 1x SS Haup and a single Huzagol hid back behind the bushes, and he resigned.

My Tiger's overrun was very effective, but despite this, his MG would roll double kill rolls twice during the game. My star unit was the Me 110 which killed an 82mm mortar, 2 snipers, 2 AT guns, a Mosin Nagant and disrupted an NCO twice. It was a fun game, my Tiger was not scratched and my Me 110 was disrupted only once.

Final round is 1943 Stalingrad, on a different map.

RedBaron

well congratulations! I guess you are in the final stage!

russians as enemy again? Smile

keep us informed

Steel_Panther

Congrats! What was your build? Nice job! tank

Field Marshal PF

My build;

1x Tiger I
1x Me 110
1x SS Haupsturmfuhrer
2x Mauser Kar 98k
1x Hungarian Infantry Company
-1x Officer
-8x Huzagol
-1x AT gun

Steel_Panther

NICE!

Shank77

Congratulations! on your victory.

Eric Marino

What you went up against wasn't very good. The T34 is a nice peice but given the scenario was a horrible choice. From the sound of it he hid his tank from yours and didn't even try to shoot soldiers with it. His top priority should have been the plane. while your units were on their way to the city he should have thrown everything at the plane. the mortar and spotter were a wasted 18 points. he could have thrown another 6 three pointers at you with that.

I wouldn't have used what you did but, from the sounds of it you used the equipment you had to the best of its ability. Well Done.

Field Marshal PF

Yeah, I was surprised, I was expecting 2 KV-1s, which have 9/9/7 AI, but apparantly he wanted the mortar more. His infantry was well used, mine were like ducks in a pond for the MG, I did not dare strafe the Maxim, and thus he killed 5 units with it. His T-34/76 hid rush my two Kar 98s and made quick work of them. Other than that, his T-34 was dancing around in the city, making sure my Tiger didn't have LOS, but eventually, he push forward to ry and make multiple close-assualts and get his 76mm on my Tiger. I repulsed the attacks despite my Tiger being alone just outside the city. I am still ashamed in taking such high causualties but perhaps I got too confident and thought he'd back off his MG, I was oh so wrong.

Attacking with the Me 110 was tricky at first, had to settle with 7 dice medium range or his MG would rip the 110 a new one. When his units started to disapear I got more daring and used it to close range strafe his infantry.

TorontoBizz

What Russian AT gun is available in 1942?

Field Marshal PF

The new one.