[[[ HMS Iron Duke - beta card DONE by N.D. ]]]

NeuralDream · [[[ HMS Iron Duke - beta card DONE by N.D. ]]]

HMS Iron Duke

Cost: $9.1M
Available: March 1914

hgraves

this class seems to suffer inordinatly in heavy weather so if we are useing squalls rules her secondarys should be penalized if in a squall sector.

in addition her seconday armament was almost intirely arrainged to fire forward and broadside (1/2 strengh) so the secondary's strongest faceing is fore.

sister ship Marlbourough took a torpedo hit amidships and sufferd a massive hull failure (her torpedo bulkheads only protected the magazines and engine rooms.) even so she showed no ill effects untill her list prevented her mains from bearing on the enemy.

hummm? any SA that brings to mind?

hgraves

speed 2
hull 5
main 16/16/14/12 broadside, 8/8/7 forward/aft
secondarys 8/7/6/5 forward, 4/4/3/2 broadside
AA 3 debateable was first class armed with dedicated AA.
broadside TT 2/2/-/-

is that how we are handleing arcs?

still unclear. Wink

NeuralDream

Yup, more or less, but I don't see the number of guns for each of your choices. How many aft, how many broadside, how many forward for each case. It's difficult to tell whether the stats are reasonable if we don't know the number of guns per arc.
Also, is that only forward torpedo? No broadside, right? Just checking.

Also, it's hull 6. Hull 5 is for 20,000 tons or so.

hgraves

NeuralDream

Ok, I'll add suggestions for these too. Check back in 5 mins in the Guidelines thread.

lotharlutjens

And my Beta Iron Duke

HMS Iron Duke Cost= $9.4 million dollars

Nation=Great Britain Class= Dreadnought Year= 1914

Speed= 2 Flag=2

Range 0 1 2 3

Main 15 12/14/12 11/13/11 9/11/9
Secon 6 5 4 2
AA 3
TT 1

Armor=8 Vital Armor=14 Hull=6

ER 4

ADMIRAL ON BOARD - Dummy SA

Lutjens out

hgraves

k here ya go.
Please proof read i may have missed something. Smile

NeuralDream

You've misspelled using, but it doesn't matter. It's not like it's the final card, so don't worry about such things. The template will change anyway with EK's suggestions. Actually, I'm still not sure how it will change. By the time we will have more or less finalised the rules he will probably have time to change it himself. It's always better having professionals do such things rather than amateurs like myself.

hgraves

one thing the final cards are really gonna need is color renderings of the ships (preferably ones that print well in Grey scale as well.)

just thinking
experimentally i tryed colorizing the Iron duke image and i feel it took me too long to be effecint humm... maybe if i used replace color...

anyway. my dos pesos...

NeuralDream

I don't see any realistic way for colouring the ships. In fact, I think it looks kinda cool the way it is now. Certainly novel. The aircraft can also be like this, but instead of top-down view in a normal view, but grayscale.

Jesse_James

Question about torps with ships.

Can I fire a trop shop from each side.

Say there was a ship right to the left and to the right, can I fire at each one or must I choose?

swarbs

Another torp question, are there re-loads or are they a one-shot sort of deal?

lotharlutjens

The simple answer is no Jesse , one attack per weapons system. If you want I can go into more detail later.

Jesse_James

Aquarius

hgraves

mayhaps we should put range 0 torpedos in the information bar with the AA value.

that may help to clear up some questions that are bound to come up.
and would help unclutter the FoF arc in formation sections.

if there is a range 2 torpedo attack to broadside should it be listed with field of fire or on the information bar?

so AA 3 torpedos 2/1 B* Armor 8 Vital 14 ect...?

*B for broadside

some vessels did not loose thier stern torpedo bays from what i have read.

but i know of no Capitol ship that had forward fireing torpedos.

or even Cruiser or Destroyer for that matter. Very Happy

lotharlutjens

Most of the ships and subs carried few if any reloads, I just got through looking at some U-Boat Data and typically they had 2 Torpedo tubes in the bow (some had one). I have not delved very deeply on the matter of reloads but they carried no more than 6 ( sometimes as low as 2 ) Interestingly enough there was even one type, the U- Cruiser, designed to carry supplies , that carried 18 reloads, ( Probably to resupply other U-Boats) but still only had 2 Bow Tubes. There were also some late war types that I haven't really looked at yet, but I will get to it when I can.

Jesse_James

Tiornu

Standard outfit for Iron Duke was fourteen torpedoes.

NeuralDream

When in the armament of this ship I see "4 × 21in submerged beam torpedo tubes" what does this mean? That it can fire with 4 T.T. or with 2 towards a broadside direction?

Tiornu

It has four submerged torpedo tubes, two on each side.
The effectiveness of such weapons is illustrated by the fact that no battleship ever managed to land a torpedo hit, Rodney claimed a hit on the crippled and helpless Bismarck in 1941, but this was never confirmed.

NeuralDream

Tiornu

Well, unless something slipped past me, they scored no hits. Definitely not against any other battleships. Maybe a wayward cruiser?
This suggests that there may be NO effective range. If it never succeeded....
Navweaps is an excellent source on torpedo capabilities. Keep in mind that a battleship firing torpedoes is usually delivering only one or two at a time, as opposed to destroyers that can fire four or more individually, and usually acting as part of a flotilla that has closed to within relatively short range of the large target that is its objective.
The Japanese were the most lavish with their dreadnought torpedo tubes.

Nathan45

A looong time ago, Bill Jurens detailed the results of a target shoot involving US Battleships and their underwater tubes. While I can't remember specifics I do recall that accuracy was abysmal, and just getting a torpedo across the finish line was something of a accomplishment. I suspect it had to do with launching amidships underwater tubes across the current created when the ship is underway. No wonder everyone deleted them.

lotharlutjens

And my Beta Iron Duke (LMS)

HMS Iron Duke Cost= $9.4 million dollars

Nation=Great Britain Class= Dreadnought Year= 1914

Speed= 2 Flag=2

Bow Broadside Stern
L Btty */12/11/9 15/14/13/11 */12/11/9
M Btty */4/3/1 6/5/4/2 */3/2/1
AA 3
TT 1

Armor=8 Vital Armor=14 Hull=6

NOTE***** With the removal of Extended Range, Confused spotting and Defensive Armament we will have quite a bit more room for any "colorful" SA's we want to add, so any ideas for the ole "Duke"

Here' One...... FLEET FLAGSHIP If four or more friendly Dreadnoughts are in play then Iron Duke gives +1 to initiative.

Any more ?

I recommend doing the cards then rehashing SA's and the making changes..... or we can go one at a time and hash it out before moving on to the next card, your choice, you are doing the cards. Either way, I am quite sure there will be changes in some if not most of the cards as new ideas come about. I can't help that.

NeuralDream

I am wondering, what is the purpose of fleet flagship? I thought that the most important fleet flagships get flag 2 and the less important get flag 1. Shouldn't that fleet flagship S.A. be given to more ships then?

Also, does this ship have D.A.?

lotharlutjens

No, no defensive armament, other than 2 small AA guns nothing smaller than 6".

I thought Iron Duke should recieve some type of "benny" being that she was "flag" to the greatest (size and reputation) fleet the world had ever seen (up till then).

Lack of numerous small calibre guns was thought OK because of the invention of Torpedo Boat Destroyers, after all it was the job of a Battleship to sink a Battleship, it was up to the lesser vessels to sink the small fry. (Or so went a popular train of thought)

NeuralDream

Ok, so since only Iron Duke gets fleet flagship, it makes sense.