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Yamato versus Iowa Class Battleship.
 
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Hood

 
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Post subject: Yamato versus Iowa Class Battleship.  Reply with quote   (Liked by:0)  Like this post
Was browsing you tube and there was a computer game called silent hunter of these 2 ships slugging it out in a gun duel and to my amazement the Iowa easily sank Yamato!!!
Not sure if this game is very realistic as surely an 18 inch gun Battleship would easily sink a 16 inch?
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PostThu May 28, 2015 1:11 pm
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gaz01

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A topic debate does exist on this somewhere on the forum.

I think it was concluded the superior US radar/gun technology would win through and enable them to stand off to a certain degree and pound away.
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PostThu May 28, 2015 3:25 pm
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BattleshipOverkill

 

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It would really depend on a lot of factors including: sea state, time of day, crew fatigue, etc.  However, as gaz01 pointed out, most believe the Iowa's would come out on top due to better fire control.  Here's an interesting page on the subject of "the best" battleship:  http://www.combinedfleet.com/baddest.htm
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PostThu May 28, 2015 4:38 pm
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Zehroflcopter

 

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Post subject: Re: Yamato versus Iowa Class Battleship. Reply with quote   (Liked by:0)  Like this post
Hood wrote:
Was browsing you tube and there was a computer game called silent hunter of these 2 ships slugging it out in a gun duel and to my amazement the Iowa easily sank Yamato!!!
Not sure if this game is very realistic as surely an 18 inch gun Battleship would easily sink a 16 inch?


That's been an ongoing debate since the end of the war, and my view on it is that the Yamato's immune zone was such that Iowa would not succeed in a duel against Yamato because Iowa had no immune zone against Yamato's shell - Radar Fire Control or not. However, as already mentioned, if the battle was at night or in poor weather, Iowa may have an edge because of RFC, or it may not - we may never really know the answer to that question, unfortunately, unless someone cares to reconstruct Yamato and recommission Iowa for a duel - we can only dream!
PostThu Jul 28, 2016 4:45 am
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Flakstruk

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Yamato should win, the design Genesis was of individual supremacy.

If Iowa brought some friends however...
PostThu Jul 28, 2016 4:57 am
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Syzmo

 

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With guns these powerful it doesnt matter if the armored citadel is being penetrated or not any hit on either ship is going to have a high chance of knocking out critical systems and degrading her combat ability. It may be near impossible to sink Yamato but it is relatively easy to reduce her combat ability to the point that she cant fight back so you can sink her at your leisure (a la Bismark).

Could Iowa afford to do that? I dont know, shes a long way from home, likely farther from home than Yamato. A single hit can force her to retreat or become stranded in enemy waters. All that said it is more likely for Iowa to get a hit with her radar range finders than for Yamato, although Yamato had excellent optical rangefinders and practical training for night fighting.
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PostThu Jul 28, 2016 2:35 pm
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CommanderSam

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I read a couple of articles quoting the inferior quality of Yamato's armor.
PostMon Aug 08, 2016 9:32 pm
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Jeffrey5665

 

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and nobody has yet mentioned tactics.

Japan's doctrine called for attempting to have the shells hit short so they'd enter the water & penetrate the hull beneath the waterline. I've always believed that would be a very difficult (and unlikely) shot. It does not require a great deal of water to significantly reduce a bullet's speed...even bullets of this size.

Yes. I am biased. Doubly so since I am not only a US citizen, I am also a veteran that served aboard the Iowa from 87 - 90.

Nonetheless, I favor the Iowa in this duel. Her guns are extremely accurate. 2 direct hit examples - school bus from 24 miles on 2nd shot. - killer tomato (10' orange balloon we used for target at sea) from 10 miles on first shot.

Yes. Yamato shells will leave a mark, but for every hit she would make, Iowa would give her several. And as for those superior optics, have you ever seen what a 16" shell can do to glass?
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PostMon Aug 08, 2016 11:40 pm
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CommanderSam

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I assume 18" shells would also bring severe damage to radar fire controls, even with near misses.
PostTue Aug 09, 2016 4:55 pm
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LcdrSwizzle

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Interestingly enough, the Yamato's shells weighed about 3,200 lbs. While most 16" guns threw shells just over 2,000 lbs, the Iowa's threw 2,700 lbs. There's only 500 lbs difference in the shells. True, that's 20% more, but the Iowa's rate of fire and accuracy would be much more than 20% better.

It's a very theoretical discussion, no matter what I think, because after all, the Americans would NEVER send the Iowa to take out the Yamato, because only a fool deals strength-to-strength. They would instead do what they did: send planes. That's dealing strength-to-weakness and works very well.
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PostTue Aug 09, 2016 5:28 pm
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Jeffrey5665

 

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If Halsey had been less of a self-seeking glory hunter, we could have looked to the Battle of San Bernardino Strait the night of October 25th/26th, 1944 featuring the Japanese Center Force against Task Force 34.

Instead we will forever have the heroic exploits of the sailors in Taffy 3.

In any case, it would have been a far bloodier affair than its' twin battle in Surigao Strait to the south (which would've been proceeding at the very same time).

C'est la vie. Besides, if history were a rum and coke, without the what ifs, it'd just be a soda.
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PostTue Aug 09, 2016 6:53 pm
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'Warspite'

 

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Weight of shell on one side - consistency of hitting with radar control on the other side. There's probably not a lot in it, possibly victory would go to the side which hit first. Hit first, hit hard and keep hitting - Jackie Fisher would have been nodding in agreement.

I have read somewhere that Yamato could not fire full 9-gun broadsides as the excessive 'whip' to the superstructure meant that the upper rotating fire control would jump its rotating ring and become dismounted. I seem to recall she was (allegedly) limited to alternating 5-gun and 4-gun salvoes.

If I was asked to place a bet my money would be on Iowa by a short head. She'd win but be badly damaged.

Barry
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PostTue Aug 16, 2016 9:48 pm
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johnsnelling

 

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1.)  Despite Yamato class 18.1 inch guns being larger, having slightly longer range and a heavier shell than Iowa class 16.0 inch, the shells the Japanese ship fired (type 91) were actually inferior to the norm for ships of the day.  The 16.0 inch gun actually had nearly equal penetration power to the 18.1 inch gun due to the difference in quality of the shells.

2.)  Iowa class had superior fire control.  While Yamato class and Iowa class had good optical fire control (Japanese maybe somewhat better), American ships had much better radar than the Japanese.  This actually gave American ships true "blindfire" capability.  This meant the opponent did not have to be within visible range.   Since the Japanese would need to be within visible range in order to engage, this limited their maximum effectiveness to about 27K yards, which is well within maximum range of a 16 inch gun.  So even though the 18 in gun could fire further, the effective range was limited by inferior fire control.  American fire control systems also had better stability control which meant an Iowa class could both shoot and maneuver at the same time (due to ability to maintain a firing solution).  Yamato class could not do that very well.  

3.)  Iowa class had better damage control systems (and better crew training at this) than the Japanese.  

4.)  Iowa class were faster (about 33 knots vs. about 27) which meant that at the opening, an Iowa class could dictate terms of engagement.

5.)  While Yamato class had better armor, that was simply because it had more of it.  Iowa class armor was actually a better design and used better quality steel.  So penetration resistance of the two ships is not as far apart as would ordinarily be assumed.

In any battleship vs. battleship fight, the advantage typically goes to whoever can start inflicting damage first.  When vital topside equipment such as rangefinders and gun directors get wiped out, it diminishes the ability of the ship to fight back.

This was written not by me but by Robert Nuebauer.
PostFri Dec 02, 2016 12:15 pm
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johnsnelling

 

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I also was a member of the USS Iowa and served briefly on the USS New Jersey.

PostFri Dec 02, 2016 12:17 pm
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